google.com, pub-2774194725043577, DIRECT, f08c47fec0942fa0 L.A.Times Crossword Corner: Saturday, Nov 8th, 2014, Bruce Venzke & Victor Fleming

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Nov 8, 2014

Saturday, Nov 8th, 2014, Bruce Venzke & Victor Fleming

Theme: None

Words: 72 (missing Q,X)

Blocks: 28

   I did today's puzzle in two stages; I had to stop about 80% of the way through, but that was OK, because I was drawing a blank in the NW and SW corners.  Upon returning to the game, I noticed the WAGs I was reluctant to try were actually the correct answers - go figure.  Oh, and an alphabet-run technical DNF, which bummed me out(*). Bruce last appeared on a Saturday, Dec 7th, in 2013, and Victor's last Saturday was back on July 7th, 2012 (LAT) - two Victors in a row~!  Triple 10-letter pinwheel design with a pair of 7- and 8-letter fills as well;

17a. Group with many hits : COSA NOSTRA - Learning moment; I did not realize this was another name for the Sicilian Mafia - hence, the "hits" - more like whacks

12d. Get romantic : BILL AND COO - I have heard of the "COOing" part, but the "BILL"~?  I looked it up; it's a bird reference - now I get it

63a. They go down to the wire : CLOSE GAMES - I tried HORSE RACES

28. Some astronauts : SPACEWOMEN - Dah~! My first thought, and yet it seemed too simple - here's a list

O N W Ra Ds~!

ACROSS:

 1. Staff leaders : MAJORDOMOs - no clue to start, then I got as far as MAJOR----

11. Common rhyme scheme : ABAB - Good guess to start

15. In top form : AT ONE'S BEST

16. Wheels : RIDE - I am hoping to buy a new ride this weekend - a 2002 Ford Escape

18. Menlo Park middle name : ALVA - Thomas Edison

19. Fuse, as ore : SMELT

20. Comic strip about a high schooler : ZITS - I like it








22. She plays Watson in "Elementary" : LIU - Lucy

23. Fourth most populous U.S. island : OAHU - I threw in GUAM;  BZZZT~!  50% correct in all the wrong places

26. Reach : CONTACT - as on one's phone

28. Surveillance aid : SPYGLASS - I'd like to live on Spyglass Lane - there's one in my neighborhood

32. Steelers ownership family name : ROONEY

33. Nanki-__ : POO - I have heard this, but I went and looked it up afterwards - oh right - the Mikado

34. Prowler : SNOOP

36. Landlord's assets: Abbr. : BLDGs

37. "... men in __" : A TUB

39. Locks that are picked : AFROs

41. Victoria's Secret spec : D CUP - HA~! I threw this in, and upon doing the write-up realized I was right - I'm sure Dennis nailed it

Hello, blue-eyes - I bet you didn't even notice they were blue (her eyes)

42.* Longtime name in baseball broadcasting : CARAY - the "Y" was my downfall, in 43d., too

44. Inset site : ATLAS

46. Valuable elemento : ORO - goldo, in Spanisho

47. "And wilt thou pledge me this for time __?": Aeschylus : ETERNE - mostly perps

49. Takes a powder : SKIPS OUT - 'round here, SKIPS OUT means someone ran off in the night without paying the rent

51. Goes south : WORSENS

53. Rested from flight : ALIT

54. "He's mine, __ am his": "Coriolanus" : OR I - two quote partials doesn't sit well with me

55. Lases or tases : ZAPS

57. Verdi aria : ERI TU

61. Star followers : MAGI - 'Tis the season once again

66. Repeat : ECHO - 'Tis the season once again
- is there an echo in here~!?

67. Revealing : TATTLE-TALE - like a sign

68. Table tennis club's supply : NETS - um, I guess they would

69. Plots : STORY LINES - ah, that kind of plot

DOWN:

1. Apple array : MACS

2. It may be ionized : ATOM - see "onward"

3. Muralist Orozco : JOSÉ


4. Where a turtle might be seen : ON A LOG - sure, why not; the last one I saw was trying to cross Rt 25, which is a 50mph road - I believe he made it

5. Some prom night wear : RENTALS - oh, the tux....never mind....

6. Brit. military award : DSO Distiguished Service Order

7. Delivery pros : OBStetrician - from the Latin "to stand by"; the medical specialist that deals with pregnancy and childbirth

8. City on the Moselle : METZ

9. "Hamlet" courtier : OSRIC

10. Electric generator component : STATOR

11. Celestial altar : ARA

13. Amy Dickinson, e.g. : ADVICE GURU

14. Mole, maybe : BEAUTY SPOT - I do not think of them as beauty; just spots

21. Stereotypical status seeker : SNOB

24. Rival of Martina and Chris : HANA - Mandlíková, Czech tennis star

25. Patriotic nickname : U.S. of A.

27. Spoiled the surprise : TOLD

29. Kid's birthday party contest : POTATO RACE - never had one

30. "No argument" : YOU'RE RIGHT - upon returning to the grid, I was able to get past "YOU", which was all I had filled, and started thinking "YOU'RE" - Duck~!

31. Prepares for filing : SORTS

35. Grammy category eliminated in 2009 : POLKA - I did not know this

38. Illegalizes : BARS - I had BANS, and that threw me

40. Zip (through) : SAIL

43*. Santa __ Valley: California wine region : YNEZ - ugh - really~? Oh well - I'm sure our California contingency got it no problem


45. Catalog giant : SPIEGEL

48. Adopts : ENACTS

50. Low clouds : STRATI

52. Paint-spill sound : SPLAT - uhhh, whooo(ups)~?

56. __ speak : SO TO - ugh - all perps

58. "Project Runway Canada" host : IMAN

59. Commuting leader? : TELE - telecommuting

60. Doesn't let sit : USES

62. Cyclades island : IOS

64. Harp, e.g.: Abbr. : STRing instrument

65. Bridge expert Culbertson : ELY

Splynter

53 comments:

Paul said...

I'm still enjoying this site most every day but don't comment... Thanks for the fun!

The clock change has me up even earlier so I'm not able to enjoy the pithy and sage comments. Was everyone else able to adjust their "inner clock" so quickly? I'll vote for the guy who says lets stop messing with the clock.

We got our first snowfall here along the NYS Lake Ontario shoreline yesterday... a trace. With a promise of much more.

TTP said...

Good morning all !

OUCH !

Sputtered and stalled and lurched forward only to fall back again. So many errors. For instance, Zip (through) was first SCAN, then SKIM, then SPED and finally SAIL when I got the L with ALIT.

I didn't have any issue in the West / Southwest. CAREY, WORSENS, ECHO and NETS going across gave me enough to see SPACE WOMEN and YOU'RE RIGHT going down.

I also had HORSE RACES to start. HORSE came out with ENACTS and SPLAT. Took quite a while to drop RACES. Thought it was CLOSE RACES.

BEAUTY SPOT was easy. Never heard of Amy Dickinson, so had no idea what she does/is, but wagged it after about 7 crossing letters.

CONTACT was the eventual answer but didn't want to let go of CONNECT. So had NO-- going down for "Spoiled the surprise." After BLGDS came the missing letter in front of -CUP, so NOLD was quickly resolved to TOLD and CONTACT became apparent. Whew !

In the end, my downfall was the Northwest. Had ATOM, On A LOG, RENTALS, DSO, OBS and STATOR going down, but could only get AT ONES BEST and SMELT across. No idea on MAJOR DOMOS, and was stuck trying to fit in a band for "Group with many hits."

I liked your write up Splynter. BTW, I was going to enter UPS for "Delivery pros" but thought he folks at FEDEX and DHL might take an exception...

Hi Paul. Welcome. My inner clock is also slow to change. I was up at 4AM CST. Probably be like that until sometime in March.

Barry G. said...

Morning, all!

This one defeated me utterly. I was able to fill in most of the NE, SE and SE, but the entire NW corner and the diagonal stripe running from the NW toward the SE remained blank until I finally turned on the red letter help.

Mistakes included CLOSE RACES instead of CLOSE GAMES and BAN instead of BAR, but the biggest problem was all the unknowns today. OSRIC, HANA, JOSE, ETERNE, YNEZ, CARAY, SPIEGEL (isn't that a German newspaper?), ROONEY, METZ, etc. Plus, I had no idea who AMY Dickinson was or what she did.

Congrats to anybody who managed to get through this one unscathed.

Big Easy said...

Well Splynter, the NW was the last to fall for me also.I had MACS SMELT OBS and STATOR, but misread 'Lionized for ionezed". This puzzle a little of everything except a theme and only WAGs and Perps saved me this morning. On the first pass I only knew ROONEY DCUP OAHU STRATI HANA ALVA & STRATI.

Long Island has to be the most populous and Manhattan second, but what is in third? Marco Island or Miami Beach?

Ther proper names always slow me down (or stop me). Ann Landers, Dear Abby,-yes. Amy Dickinson- never heard of. Nanki-WHO? A better clue would have been 'Dog ____'. ETERNE in 47A was strictly a perp as the three long downs filled easily afterCARAY MAGI ECHO and NETS.

Santa YNEZ was new to me, as were JOSE OSRIC IMAN ELY and filling in the Latin ERITU is always challenging.

BILL AND COO- I still don't get it even after Splynt's explanation. An animal dance maybe?

SPYGLASS Hill- We are vacationing to Carmel next week and will go BY. My golf game is not good enough for that place nor would I pay those green fees. At least it's "cheap" as compared to Pebble Beach.

"Spyglass Hill Golf Course
Resort Guests $385 incl. cart"

TTP said...

Hi Barry,

You are correct. The magazine is Der Spiegel.

My mother used to get the Spiegel catalog in the mail. As a young one, it was my least favorite to look through. It didn't have toys.

CARAY (and the spelling) would be relatively easy for most Chicago and St Louis baseball fans due to patriarch Harry. Son Skip and grandson Chip would be familiar to Atlanta baseball fans.

I should say, "... the spelling should be easy..." I even have a favorite sweatshirt from Harry Caray's. But I spelled it wrong in my first post !

No problem with ROONEY for this lifelong Steelers fan. A much respected family.

Still kicking myself for not getting METZ. I was thinking of all the towns up and down the river that I could, but none came to mind with just four letters. I spent three years in Rhineland Palatinate and Baden Wuttemburg, and did river tours of the castles on the Mosel and Rhine.

It was only when I read the writeup did I notice the spelling was Moselle, not Mosel. Same river, but in France, not Germany. D'OH !

desper-otto said...

Good morning!

Splynter, I was with you in spirit this morning. Hand up for GUAM, BANS, and INEZ. Other stumbles were BEAUTYmark and SlIPS OUT. Fixed all of 'em except INEZ. Bzzzt! CARAI looked OK to me, great baseball fan that I am.

I did not know that DS was a chemical symbol. Never heard of Darmstadtium. Sounds like a dang ballpark. I don't think it'd been discovered when I took Chemistry and pterodactyls flew.

Al Cyone said...

Like others, I struggled in the NW. But a WAG here and a WAG there and I avoided the expected DNF.

I only know Amy Dickinson from NPR's Wait Wait... Don't Tell Me!, where she's a regular panelist.

I've known "BILL AND COO" since I was a kid. Not as a romantic phrase but as the title of famed Hollywood reporter Ken Murray's classic 1948 fantasy film. You can (and, I think, should) watch it here.

Dudley said...

Hello Puzzlers -

Not much trouble, until hitting that SW corner. I couldn't guess at Space Women, and never heard of that Caray guy. Had Redo for Echo, really making a roadblock. Only Nanki Poo was obvious (I was in The Mikado in high school). Got there eventually.

Polka certainly didn't leap to mind, despite my having been saturated with it as a kid - around here we had lots of Polka orchestras and dances, an assortment of accordion studios, even a lively TV program devoted to Polka. Not much now...

HeartRx said...

Good morning all!

You got me with your O N W Ra Ds, Splynter. Of course, I had to check every single link for some kind of Easter Egg. But why didn’t you link Ar-gon instead of Ra-don?

I solved this one starting in the NE and proceeded clockwise through the grid. NW was last to fall, but RENTALS gave me my first real toehold there. I was pretty sure about MACS, ATOM and JOSE, so MAJOR DOMO finally came to mind. But I had DSM instead of DSO, so COSA NOSTRA wasn’t peeking out at me. Then I tried DSC. Nope. Finally changed it to “O” and finally “saw” it. And TTP – I fell into the same “Moselle – Mosel” trap, looking for German cities. Duh!

And last Friday I wanted Santa YNEZ, but the puzzle answer was “Cruz.” This time with the Z in place, I patiently waited for perps.

For “catalog giant,” my first thought was Sears Roebuck. Remember those huge Christmas catalogs that came out around this time of year?

Time to get to all those leaves in the yard. Have a great day, everyone!

Lemonade714 said...

Funny what a difference a few years makes as COSA NOSTRA, SPIEGEL and some of the other struggles were memories from childhood.

We have YNEZ a few times this year.

I really enjoyed reading about the female astronauts. Thanks for that and the rest Splynter

TTP said...


Marti, if Moselle got you too, then I won't kick myself so hard.

I was sent the following, as a chemistry problem...

Barium
Carbon
Potassium

Thorium
Astatine

Arsenic
Sulfur

Uranium
Phosphorous

HeartRx said...

TTP, too easy for this science grad:
BaCK ThAt AsS UP

TTP said...

HA !

Thanks Marti, I had no idea what was going on !

Husker Gary said...

Thanks Bruce and Victor for a very impressive grid, fun cluing and a nice workout but I failed at the Natick intersection of ER_TU and _MAN. I thought it was an A or O and of course it was an I.

Musings
-The first SPACE WOMAN was one of many firsts the Russians had before we caught up. The surname the US OF A’s first female in space was 16 Across
-An ABAB pattern whose fourth line tells of our next week’s weather
-Do you remember this wonderful cross-cultural scene with a spyglass?
-AFROS changed UNCLE to US OF A. OBS not UPS,
-Harry CARAY’s candor, as seen in the first paragraph, infuriated some players
-This product asserted it would eliminate TATTLE TALE gray from your laundry. Wasn’t there a product for gray hair too?
-Where will Downton Abbey STORY LINES go this season?
-Turtles on our fairways are very common
-My Czech MIL has picked out two POLKA’s for her funeral
-Mom got this catalog not SPIEGELS
-What famous actor’s last role was hunting down criminals who SKIP OUT on bail in this car?

inanehiker said...

Nearly solved this one, following the same pattern as Marti from NE clockwise, but the NW did me in.
I tried some alternative answers which led me further astray: Linz and Lodz for Metz, Yoric for Osric in "Hamlet" clue, and Formals for rentals in the prom clue. The fact that they had letters in common kept them in there much longer than they should have. Also wanted an answer with "users" at the end for 17a Group with many hits.
I'm from the land of the Cardinal Nation so Harry Caray fell into place once I switched Inez to Ynez.
Amy Dickinson is a syndicated columnist in lots of newspapers-- the more modern Dear Abby/AnnLanders -- her column is called "Ask Amy"
Cool fall day here, great weather for the state Cross Country championships held on a local golf course every year. I usually volunteer at the medical tent, but they had plenty of help this year.
Have a great weekend, thanks Splynter!

Spitzboov said...

Good morning everyone.

Got most of it after a fashion. Involked red letter help with BILL AND COO/ROONEY cross, and POLKA; didn't know it had ben a Grammy category.
Sussed longs like COSA NOSTRA and POTATO RACE ok, so they provided launch points for much of the solve.
I enjoy B. Venzke's weekday puzzles, so I was interested in how this one would go.
Learning how to spell YNEZ

Welcome aboard, Paul. I'm at the head of the Mohawk Valley, ESE of you, so a lot of your Lake Effect comes our way. Don't be a stranger.

Irish Miss said...

Good Morning:

Well, this almost did me in, but the Irish stubbornness prevailed, and, with lots and lots of patience and perseverance, I finished w/o help. The NW was the last to fall and that took quite a while.

Kudos to Bruce and Victor for a super-challenging Saturday workout and thanks to Splynter for 'splainin' it all so well.

Have a great day.

Lucina said...

Hello, puzzlers.

Hard, hard, hard. This was a turtle crawl for me as it took way too long to establish a toehold. One cell at a time, however, and the sense of it eventually opened up.

It's an amazing feat of construction but the obscurities were often baffling. I finally just took my BEST stab on some and it was right!

COSA NOSTRA and SPYGLASS were the first long fill but that let me spread out from there. The entire south then came together when I took a chance on SPLAT; ELY and IMAN were all perps. I know nothing about Project Runway much less the Canadian host. I've seen Peter Gunn enough times to know he's involved.

AFROS was a cute misdirection so that provided a basis for the center spot to unfold.

This was grand entertainment, thank you Bruce and Victor! Thanks to Splynter as well. I desperately wanted UPS at 7D and refused to give it up for a long time.

Have a delightful Saturday, everyone! I'll read you later.

Yellowrocks said...

Nanki POO was my second entry after ALVA. I love G&S operas. Nanki Poo was the Mikado's son, disguised as a wandering minstrel. The Wandering Minstrel song has become my earworm this AM.
We get Ask Amy in our paper every day.
BILL AND COO was obvious to me. I guess it is old fashioned, but being a senior citizen I remember a lot of old fashioned things. It means to kiss and cuddle like lovebirds. "If you bill and coo with someone you love, you talk quietly to them and kiss them. If birds bill and coo, they touch beaks and make noises to each other."
I agree that I don't see the beauty in BEAUTY SPOT.
We used to call the Sears catalog the Wish Book. I haven't seen the Spiegel one in years.
DSM? DSC? I looked up the O, technical DNF for just that one cell, but it helped me wag COSA NOSTRA, which means our thing.I shoulda had that one.

Irish Miss said...

Luciana - I just now read your post re the pot stickers. When I shop again, I'll see what's available and give them a try. Aside to Argyle-your taste-testing offer sailed right over my head, as I have no intention of making them, just buying and trying someone else's hard work! :-)

Chairman Moe said...

Big Easy - play this course Pacific Grove when you visit Monterey and Pebble Beach area. Great views; links style course; sporty; and less than 25% the cost to play Spyglass

Misty said...


Well, like others I had lots of NW trouble too, but was pleased that other sections filled in pretty quickly, though with some goofs as I later discovered. Had MAGS instead of MAGI for "Star followers" (Hey, I read "People" magazine and they certainly follow the stars). Had SLIPS OUT instead of SKIPS and so didn't get POLKA (seriously, POLKA was a Grammy category?). And debated between CRUZ and YNEZ before getting it right.

Funniest clue: Delivery pros for OBS.

A turtle on a log? Really? We have a foot long Gopher tortoise (named 'Gophie' of course). She might be able to get up on a log, but there's no way she could stay there without tipping over.

Finally, Hi Paul, nice to meet you!

Have a great weekend, everybody!

Chairman Moe said...

TTP: How 'bout dem Stillers!
Here we go Steelers, Here we go!!

Chairman Moe said...

"puzzling thoughts"

Where to begin ... well, literally, I began in the SW and moved east across the grid; got all of the SE except for GAMES/IMAN intersect; the NE fell after a couple WAGS, and then

The NW! I had no clue! I kinda figured 1D was MACS/PODS/PADS, but I had SALT for 2D, TUXEDOS for 5D, YORIC for 9D, and so on. Just caved and started looking things up on Google. Oh well, I ain't perfect!!

Chairman Moe said...

No "puzzle theme" limericks today, but I am offering two, and hope I don't violate the "no politics" rule for posting. Our limerick group had to come up with a lim that was based on this past week's election. Mine is the second one, but the first was pretty funny, regardless of your party affiliation:

There once was a midterm election,
That ended with such a collection
Of new electees,
From the top GOPs,
It gave pundits like Rush an erection!


The old Senator said, with compunction,
"I've been served with a formal injunction.
I lied, cheated and stole,
To achieve my own goal;
My sins caused 'electile' dysfunction!"

Avg Joe said...

Tough outing today. First full circle of the grid yielded, in order, DS_ for 6d, AB__ for 11a, Alva for 18a, Liu for 22a, _Cup for 41a, Zaps for 55a, Ynez for 43d (Cruz didn't cross my mind, thankfully) and Ma_i for 51a. Not much help anywhere.

Slowly started wagging at that point, and it eventually came together, though there were lots of erasures Slip to Skip e.g.). Didn't think I'd get it, but finally did.

Polka Grammys? Sure. Brave Combo won twice for best album. <a href="https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSDifGxwSBo'>Purple Haze</a>. Seriously. Jimi Hendrix covered in a polka.

Avg Joe said...

Misfire on Purple Haze Try again.

Lucina said...

IrishMiss:
The potstickers I've bought require cooking them in boiling water for a few minutes then lightly browning them in a skillet. Makes my mouth water just thinking about them.

I doubt that solving a puzzle on the computer would be as much fun for me as paper is; the whole process of going from a few letters to filling an entire grid gives me such a high. I love it.

desper-otto said...

Polka music was big when I was a kid. Every Saturday night there'd be a live polka band at the Caroline Ballroom. Farmers would finish their chores early so they could get there on time. One week it'd be Frankie Yankovic and the next it'd be Romy Gosz or Whoopee John Wilfahrt (who was always called simply Whoopee John for obvious reasons). Ah, those were the days....

Ol' Man Keith said...

I enjoyed finding COSA NOSTRA in the pzl. It has been a while since I saw this term for the Sicilian Black Hand. Sounds poetic to the English ear, and yet it is the unassuming "Our Thing" in the mother tongue.
Whether the "mob," the "mafia," or just the "boys," it is a weirdly begotten organization mixing romantics and thugs. Reading about them as a kid, I gained my first appreciation for an entity at least as powerful as many governments, and that, like governments, sets its own rules, laws, taxes, and enforcement methods. I seem to recall that these "made men" began in Sicily as a political insurgency (think of ISIS today), and morphed over time into a greedy racketeering outfit. In some ways COSA NOSTRA represents the purest form of Capitalism.
I'm pretty sure that during WWII, the mob negotiated deals with the US Govt that helped root out fascists in Italy and (correct me if I'm wrong!) cleared our east coast harbors of saboteurs.

GarlicGal said...

Hey, D-O, The Big Joe Polka Show still runs on the RFD network. It's pretty entertaining...on a slow TV night...

I didn't get a tada today. A few errors that all looked OK to me. CARAI/INEZ- that one I should have caught!

Spyglass, Pebble, Poppy Hills are all just about 40 mins from me. What a spectacular part of CA.

Everyone enjoy your Saturday.

Jayce said...

What Lucina said expresses my feelings exactly: "Hard, hard, hard. ... It's an amazing feat of construction but the obscurities were often baffling." Looking back on it after having solved it, it seems much easier in retrospect. Of course, most puzzles do.
I agree about Yoric, Nanki-Poo, and BEAUTY SPOT (although I first filled in BEAUTY mark.)
Yellowrocks, from last night, I was not picking a nit about how you spelled gyoza. It turns out I was wrong anyway. Gyoza is not the Japanese pronunciation for guo-tie (鍋貼), it is the Japanese pronunciation of jiaozi (餃子).
I am vindicated at work (in my own head and heart anyway). A proposal I made over a year ago, which my boss ridiculed and insulted, has recently been implemented and is deemed to be working extremely well, having solved a communications problem that had been plaguing us for years. The programmer has been given the credit (and a $1000 attaboy award.) And my boss is very proud of himself.
Best wishes to you all.

Robinson said...

RE: Island Populations

Scanning this chart it seems as if they count Puerto Rico as a U.S. island. So its;
1. Long Island
2. Puerto Rico
3. Manhattan
4. Oahu
5. Staten Island

Didn't look too hard for a U.S.-only population grid. This list is the best I could do.

Bluehen said...

Typical Saturday slog. I got through the puzzle to get my tada minute, but I wasted far too much of the day to get there. As is my habit on these really tough puzzles, I got up from the computer (twice) for an hour or so to clear my head. It really helps.
Splynter, hands up for liking "Zits". Its the comic I save for last. "Pickles" is usually pretty good too.
Paul, snow already? I remember one year, '82? or'83?, we had a trace of snow in Oswego on October 15. Ridiculous weather in winter, but the summers made up for it.
Have a great weekend, everyone.

Irish Miss said...

Lucina - Sorry, I just noticed that I gave you an extra A in my last post! :-)

Lucina said...

IrishMiss:
Not a problem. You should see other spelling variations of my name, not to mention the mispronunciations!

HeartRx said...

Chairman Moe, thanks so much for the link to Pacific Grove golf course. It gives everyone on the corner the opportunity to become acquainted with “kikuyu" grass. That word alone is sure to bail me out on some tricky crossword constructing projects, and well worth the price of admission.

BTW, I loved both of the limericks, but yours was a real hoot. "Electile dysfunction," indeed!

Lime Rickey said...

Lucina@12:16: "I doubt that solving a puzzle on the computer would be as much fun for me as paper is; the whole process of going from a few letters to filling an entire grid gives me such a high".

How do you know if you haven't tried it? It's the same process (and I don't have to try to decipher my printing!). And think of all those trees you'd be saving.

Chairman Moe said...

Marti @ 2:33

Glad you liked the lim's!

With regard to Kikuyu Grass, the first time I remember hearing about this kind of "turf" was when it was pointed out on broadcasts of the LA Open at Riviera Country Club in Pacific Palisades CA. Gary McCord loves to chide the pros whenever they get into a lie in the Kikuyu rough, especially around the greens. Many pros look like rank amateurs when they try to extract the ball from that "grass". I love the reference in the link to Kikuyu above that describes it as a "noxious weed"!

BTW, I played Pacific Grove once (30 years ago) when I played it, Pebble and Spyglass over a three day weekend. Pebble was $105 per round back then; Spyglass was $60. Now, Pebble costs $500 (cart or caddy extra) and Spyglass runs about $375. You could play no fewer than a dozen rounds at Pacific Grove for the same $. And you're abutting the same ocean! LOL!

Chairman Moe said...

Lime Rickey @ 3:19

I know that YMMV, but I have to side with Lucina on this one; I've done puzzles on both the computer and in print (on an actual newspaper - made, I trust from recycled pulp), and it's way more fun to do them in print. I use ink, so erasures are not allowed! Maybe a "write-over", as I call them. (But hopefully that's not too often)

It just "feels" better to use pen/pencil/paper when doing a CW Puzzle.

Lime Rickey said...

Moe@3:34: "It just "feels" better to use pen/pencil/paper when doing a CW Puzzle."

That's fine, of course. To each his own (as the French say; though they say it in French . . . because that's just the way they are).

But it seemed to me that Lucina (a) hadn't even tried solving online and (b) thought the "process" would somehow be different.

At one time I was one of those who'd say that if you weren't driving a car with a manual transmission you weren't really driving. And maybe it's true. But you should at least give an automatic transmission a try.

Avg Joe said...

East is east, west is west and never the twain shall meet.

This paper vs pixel conversation has been had ad nauseum. There will be no converts. I'm on Lucina's side since I like to see the entire "landscape" of the puzzle while solving, and do consider any electronic assistance, even so minor as the "tada", to be a cheat. But it's not worth arguing about it again and again.

So......How about those Cubs?....:-)

Chairman Moe said...

LR @ 3:50; I agree, you should at least try solving a crossword on-line or via computer before commenting that you'd not enjoy the process. Of course, I can honestly say that if I never jump out of an airplane, even with a perfectly safe and operating parachute, I still don't think I'd enjoy it!! ;^)

Oh, and as for auto transmission vs a manual gear-box . . . well, I've driven for far more years with a "PRNDL", but for the past 6 have been driving a nice 2-door German Auto, with a 6-speed/clutch etc. I am really thinking that I don't ever want to go back to an automatic . . . even when having to drive in this S FL traffic

61Rampy said...

Since nobody tried to answer Husker Gary's question, I will give it a shot. How about Steve McQueen in "The Hunter"? His role was Ralph 'Papa' Thorson. I think this is correct because of watching Pawn Stars.
As far as the puzzle goes, major DNF, but I did better than I thought I would.

Yellowrocks said...

Put me down for paper and pencil and I have tried electronic several times. I do not care for it. I read the newspaper so no additional trees are cut down.

Lucina said...

Lime Rickey@3:19
Actually I have tried to solve puzzles on line and find it quite frustrating. Moreover, though I know trees are involved, I want to support the newspaper as long as possible.

I've read and heard reports that pulp is made from specially grown trees which are replaced by seedlings once they are cut.

Believe me, I had no intention of starting this debate as we've been through it many times. I was simply expressing my delight when I solve a difficult and challenging puzzle such as today's.

Bluehen said...

Lucina, I understand and I support you, even though I switched to digital a while back. I still get the same "high, or rush" as I did when I solved with paper and ink. Solving is solving. You stay true to yourself and do what makes you happy. Life is too short. . .Love, Bluehen.

Lucina said...

ChmnMoe:
I forgot to tell you how much I liked your limericks!

Monitor said...

Isn't there still a five-post limit? Seven seems a bit much.

JD said...

Big Easy, if you do play golf in Pacific Grove , which I highly recommend, check out the Monarch Butterfly Sanctuary which is near by...free. Millions of those beautiful creatures cluster high in the trees...awesome. If they are not flitting about, sometimes they look like dead leaves.

Every Saturday I am completely astounded by my lack of knowledge. sigh.

Having just been on a cruise down the Rhine and Moselle in July, I had no problem with Metz. There were cathedrals, castles and vineyards everywhere.

JD said...

Metz

Bill G. said...

Thank goodness we have anonymous folks looking out for the integrity of this blog. Where would we be without them? We would likely become overrun with a raging bunch of ne'er-do-wells, flouting the rules, posting positive contributions willy-nilly. Anarchy!

Metz looks like a really pretty place. I noticed the patterns in the cobble stones.

I've been through Pacific Grove a couple of times though I think the butterflies were sipping on Margaritas in Mexico at the time.

Mike the Tiger said...

Gueax Tide. What a crazy day. I'm glad the huskers won. The Buckeyes too. Auburn loses so who is left to the playoff?

Florida State
Mississippi State
Oregon
Alabama